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Jul - The Cutting Room Floor - Godzilla: Monster of Monsters-Hedorah New poll - New thread - New reply
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GraphicsFish
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Posted on 09-09-16 06:38:11 AM Link | Quote
I'm not particularly in the know-how of digging for data in games, save for picking out unused sprites in a tile editor, but I wanted to get a discussion going on the topic this game; particularly one of the boss monsters.

Hedorah the smog monster is shown in his flying form during the cast call at the end of the game. He does not fly while fighting him. It seems strange to me that they'd render an entirely unique sprite just for the credits.

I guess I have two trains of thoughts regarding this sprite's place on TCRF...

Apologies if this is something better suited for the game's notes page

A.) Assuming it WASN'T rendered just for the sake of the credits, it would be fair to assume that he may have changed form depending on the fighting monster; Godzilla fights bipedal Hedorah, while Mothra fights flying Hedorah. If the sprite is shown during the credits, can it be assumed that the decision to not make him fly in battle was removed near the end of development and there might be a way to enable some unused flying behavior in-game?

B.) I believe that "in game" only refers to the part that can be played, correct? Like when an otherwise unused track/sound effect can still be heard in a sound test, it's still considered unused, right? Would this graphic still then have a place on this game's page?
ICEknight
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Posted on 09-10-16 10:41:01 PM Link | Quote
Assumptions ashmuptions.

Please try to get some proof that it wasn't just made for the ending first.
GraphicsFish
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Posted on 09-11-16 05:11:10 AM Link | Quote
Didn't answer my question, but okay.

I laid out both possibilities;

A.) If it isn't, there might be data for it. As I said, I don't know how to go about looking for it. Not ASKING anybody to do so, just making an observation.

B.) If it IS, would it qualify as "not used", considering it's not present in the part that you actually play? Like the example I gave: Tracks still present in a sound test that aren't present during normal gameplay are still classified as "unused," despite being accessible normally by the player.

I can offer this: The sprite IS stored with the rest of Hedorah's sprites, and not with the other graphics that are used for after completing the game. That alone doesn't say much, but it's something.
ThatGodzillaFan
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Posted on 09-11-16 05:58:57 AM Link | Quote
The unused track on the GMOM page isn't accessible through the game's sound test though. As for Hedorah, I don't see any evidence that the flying form would actually appear ingame.

I searched through of the kaiju values using this code from ファミコンチート集 Wiki:

0129-01-00- enemy monster [00-07]
00: King Ghidorah
01: Mechagodzilla
02: Hedorah
03: Gigan
04: Baragon
05: Mogera
06: balun (AKA Varan)
07: Gezora

None of them point to Hedorah's flying form so I assume the sprite was exclusively created for the credits or they scrapped him too early into development so no data exists. But hey, I could be wrong, I'm not all that great at finding unused content within NES games. I only found Angilas and Rodan because I found their codes on a Japanese website. I prefer working with newer games.

Glad to see there's some interest in this game though! There's a lot of unused content in Godzilla games just waiting to be discovered.
GraphicsFish
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Posted on 09-11-16 08:38:36 PM (last edited by GraphicsFish at 09-11-16 10:17:45 PM) Link | Quote
Interesting.

I wasn't referring to GMOM's music in particular, I just recall instances on other game pages that "in-game" excludes sound tests, so I was wondering if by that standard, credits would count also.

But yes, even with what little I knew about game coding, I thought that Flying Hedorah would probably be programmed as separate monster. So, given that value chart, seems to be just a sprite.
Unless it's just an unused attack/behavior of sorts.

Also curious, on a related note, the North American instruction book says that Varan has some sort of "jumping" move, which he certainly doesn't have.


Willing to bet that the person who wrote that just goofed, though. Still found it neat, though.

Thanks for the input though! really cool!
GraphicsFish
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Posted on 09-13-16 08:41:43 PM Link | Quote
(Had to look up the rules about double posting; looks like it's acceptable in this case.)

I had looked into this before and I don't know why I neglected to dig into it more before my original post.

After looking at Hedorah's graphics in a tile editor, it looks like there are more tiles for another sprite of Hedorah's flying form. I assembled the graphic shown in the credits (left) and there were leftover tiles; they make up the graphic on the right. I can't guarantee that it's assembled 100% correctly, but I'm fairly certain that it's accurate.


commercial photography locations
ThatGodzillaFan
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Posted on 09-14-16 09:36:45 AM (last edited by ThatGodzillaFan at 09-14-16 06:27:36 PM) Link | Quote
Interesting! I don't really get what Hedorah is supposed to be doing, but if there's more sprites for the flying form, it seems like it was to appear ingame. I still don't believe they programmed the other form though. They had Rodan's sprite but his programming was never finished, so its possible that its the same case for Hedorah's flying form.
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Posted on 09-14-16 11:25:12 AM Link | Quote
Now that's something worth adding to the wiki.
GraphicsFish
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Posted on 09-14-16 05:35:11 PM Link | Quote
It looks like Hedorah is just tilting to his right, like a gliding motion. Rodan's sprites seem to have him flying in a similar motion.

Another little tidbit that I found was what looks like a note or something from one of the developers.

commercial photography locations

A couple of tiles of this can be found near Mougera's graphics. I plugged it into a translator and it came out to "Butterbur," a type of plant. That translation either didn't come out right, was some sort of inside joke, or those places were reserved for graphics of that plant, or something. There's only one type of level that has anything botanical.

Anyway, it's there though. Whatever it means.
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Posted on 09-14-16 07:13:01 PM Link | Quote
Originally posted by GraphicsFish

Another little tidbit that I found was what looks like a note or something from one of the developers.

commercial photography locations

A couple of tiles of this can be found near Mougera's graphics. I plugged it into a translator and it came out to "Butterbur," a type of plant. That translation either didn't come out right, was some sort of inside joke, or those places were reserved for graphics of that plant, or something. There's only one type of level that has anything botanical.

Anyway, it's there though. Whatever it means.


アキ in this context usually is 空き, which means "empty". It was common among game developers to mark empty space in the ROM as アキ. Nothing terribly special here.


____________________
GraphicsFish
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Posted on 09-14-16 08:07:31 PM Link | Quote
Makes sense. I initially assumed that's what it was, but I plugged into a translator just for the sake of doing so. Cool to know for sure though.
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Jul - The Cutting Room Floor - Godzilla: Monster of Monsters-Hedorah New poll - New thread - New reply


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