Jul -- News: [sighs] (Economy)

geeogree
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Posted on 09-30-08 03:52:26 AM

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A crash is exactly what we need. Find the bottom and then work our way from there.

Why do people think that borrowing 700 billion dollars more is going to solve a credit crisis?

Hiryuu

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Posted on 09-30-08 11:14:07 AM

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Originally posted by geeogree
...Why do people think that borrowing 700 billion dollars more is going to solve a credit crisis?

Got me. Everything I keep reading says 'DON'T FREAKING DO IT'.

I think I was reading not too long ago some 85 billion dollar plan that, if you gave roughly everyone in the US 18+ that split evenly, it would give everyone $425K. Of course, it'd be taxed, so say 30% is taken out...that's still $295K or so.

I mean if you want to fuel an economy to a tenth of what they're wanting and you could do it as easily as that...that would seem rather logical to me...especially with people having issues with mortgages. Course, with the way the financial system is I doubt that something like I just described 'would ever work'.

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Posted on 09-30-08 11:18:17 AM

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"Dow average drops 777 points"

00:00'00" Xkeeper: basically, Wall Street is throwing a temper tantrum because Uncle Sam didn't give him $700 billion dollars in "sorry, you fucked up, here's some money to try again" money

My honest opinion is that, perhaps instead of giving tons of money to these corporations, we should strengthen regulations (the deregulating being what got us into this mess) and maybe, oh, I don't know, start working towards providing help to the people who have bad morgages. Bottom up.

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Kles

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Posted on 09-30-08 01:50:46 PM

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IF WE GIVE THE BAILOUT, WE ARE ON THE SLIPPERY SLOPE TO SOCIALISM

Hiryuu

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Posted on 09-30-08 05:58:58 PM

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Originally posted by Kles
IF WE GIVE THE BAILOUT, WE ARE ON THE SLIPPERY SLOPE TO SOCIALISM

Give into?

Yea, pretty much.

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geeogree
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Posted on 10-01-08 03:50:49 AM

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not to be too partisan about this issue but it was the democrats that brought about this problem originally.

The Clinton administration forced banks to offer more loans/mortgages to low and middle income families. Sub-prime mortgages went from being 2% of all mortgages in the early 90's to being around 30% somewhere in the mid 2000's. Fannie Mae took on most of the risk for these mortgages which built of a housing bubble. Prices continued to go up forcing more radical types of loans which are more and more risky.

Now, to be fair I'll swing back and blame Bush and the Republicans to a certain degree. Bush got us in to Iraq and has been spending billions of dollars a month on a war that was won in 2003?!? So the govt. goes more and more in to debt and eventually inflation starts to catch up with us. The price of food, gas, etc goes up and up which forces people to choose between food or shelter. Most pick shelter because you can live without a home but not without food.

In short everyone is responsible. Democrats forced a huge increase in sub-prime loans which caused the housing bubble and created the huge forclosure problem. The Republicans under Bush increased the cost of living. In the end it is regular Americans (and in time the rest of the world) that will suffer because politicians only really worry about getting re-elected.

This crisis was not forseen. There have been people on the fringe calling for more control over the mortgage crisis they saw coming but like most other problems that seem to come across the table of the government, they don't bother acting until a real problem occurs.

Shadic
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Posted on 10-01-08 03:07:42 PM

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Originally posted by Fate Testarossa
Stocks skidded this afternoon, with the Dow's nearly 778-point drop being the worst single-day point loss ever, after the House rejected the government's $700 billion bank bailout plan."

That's misleading, however. It is the largest drop, however.. It's something like the 14th largest drop when you put it into the "How big of a percentage fell in one day?" category.. Which I think reflects more information.

Also, fuck corporations for screwing us over, and fuck having less regulation on them.

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Hiryuu

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Posted on 10-06-08 05:43:41 PM

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Dow's below 10K. Dropped 700 points again.

Course, it's not the end of the day yet...but it can always get better or worse.

Bailout did shit, obviously.

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Posted on 10-06-08 05:52:55 PM

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There's a reason for that, too:

Article

Fears are mounting that many Wall Street banks and financial firms will refuse to participate in the US government's $700bn bail-out package, leaving global markets and world economies in a perilous state for months to come.

'There is a growing feeling that banks ... might instead decide to tough it out,' said Thomas Caldwell, chairman and CEO of Caldwell Financial, a $1bn-plus fund manager.

So wait, after all this YOU NEED TO PASS THIS OR WE ALL DIE, what could possibly be behind this reasoning?

One of the least attractive elements is a section designed to curb executive pay at banks that participate in the bail-out package. These include limiting stock-related pay and banning 'golden parachutes' for executives.

'I think this hodge-podge of regulations and rules will be enough to put many [chief executives] off participating,' Caldwell said.

Oh. "No, we don't want your money if it means we have to go without our five mansions."

Sigh.

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Hiryuu

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Posted on 10-06-08 06:04:57 PM (last edited by Fate Testarossa at 10-06-08 04:56 PM)

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It's bouncing up and down between a 680 and 800 pt. loss now. It dipped as low as 9.5K as of today.

If it starts to reach 8K or something like that, worry a bit. The likelihood is it'll iron out but this is quite a volatile period.

EDIT: Stocks closed only ~370 down. Just a hair under 10K now.

Oil's at 87 bucks or so.

Well...maybe we'll get cheap gas out of this.

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Posted on 10-07-08 04:15:30 AM

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Originally posted by Fate Testarossa
Well...maybe we'll get cheap gas out of this.

Or the oil companies will use this to their advantage, keeping gas prices where they are.

Those bastards.

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geeogree
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Posted on 10-07-08 05:39:31 AM

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-Oh. "No, we don't want your money if it means we have to go without our five mansions."-

yeah, no wonder the top 0.1% keep getting richer while the rest of us have to work our asses off just to stay even (which lots can't even do). I just love how a CEO can do a bad job but still get paid 30 million dollars to run a company. I'm sorry but even if that CEO worked 24 hours a day from the day they started until the day they left they still don't deserve to earn as much as the rest of the workforce combined. It's ridiculous. How about paying the people that actually do the REAL work in a company rather than paying the executives to plan and analyze strategy and a whole bunch of other stuff that doesn't actually create any value. I'm not actually suggesting that the people in the executive positions don't create any value but that the amount they contribute can't realistically be 10-100 times more than any other employee.

And gas prices will come down. They won't go down to the same price that they were when oil first hit the equivalent price on its way up. It never comes down quite as far after it's been high for a while. We've adjusted to the higher price so there is less resistance once the price starts dropping. Although I'm convinced that gas prices won't ever really go back to where they were.

Rachel Mae

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Posted on 10-07-08 05:45:48 AM

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Originally posted by geeogree
I'm sorry but even if that CEO worked 24 hours a day from the day they started until the day they left they still don't deserve to earn as much as the rest of the workforce combined. It's ridiculous. How about paying the people that actually do the REAL work in a company rather than paying the executives to plan and analyze strategy and a whole bunch of other stuff that doesn't actually create any value.

What? That's the most un-American thing I've ever heard!

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Hiryuu

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Posted on 10-07-08 07:16:17 PM (last edited by Fate Testarossa at 10-07-08 04:16 PM)

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For today:

Dow 9,447.11: -508.39 (-5.11%)

So maybe we will hit 8K at this rate.

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geeogree
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Posted on 10-08-08 03:04:11 AM

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Originally posted by Fate Testarossa
For today:

Dow 9,447.11: -508.39 (-5.11%)

So maybe we will hit 8K at this rate.

hooray for the bailout?

Hiryuu

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Posted on 10-09-08 06:28:01 PM (last edited by Fate Testarossa at 10-09-08 03:54 PM)

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Stocks under 9K...

Down and down it goes...where it stops no one knows...

EDIT: 8.6K...

Man I hope none of you have stocks.

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Posted on 10-09-08 08:05:49 PM

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This makes it what, -20% total?

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Hiryuu

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Posted on 10-09-08 08:16:43 PM (last edited by Fate Testarossa at 10-09-08 05:17 PM)

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Give or take.

Wasn't the stock market crash of '29 about ~33% in three days or something for Dow?

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Rachel Mae

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Posted on 10-10-08 01:10:48 AM

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I guess it's a good thing I was forced to pull out my retirement funds early...

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