Register - Login
Views: 99847883
Main - Memberlist - Active users - Calendar - Wiki - IRC Chat - Online users
Ranks - Rules/FAQ - Stats - Latest Posts - Color Chart - Smilies
05-04-22 02:36:06 AM
Jul - Gaming - Genre staples New poll - New thread - New reply
Next newer thread | Next older thread
BatElite
Member
Level: 35


Posts: 266/345
EXP: 274542
For next: 5394

Since: 04-24-17

Pronouns: they/them, preferably she/her (fluidity is heck)

Since last post: 19 days
Last activity: 3 days

Posted on 06-17-19 05:27:28 PM Link | Quote

Hi~
Do any of you browse itch.io much? Has anyone here by any chance played Guan's Island? I think it's about 10 minutes long if you're not familiar with it, and for some weird reason I'd recommend it. (I don't know what you'd do if you don't have access to Windows/WINE, Exporting GMS games to non-native OSes is obtuse and IDK how you'd manage it.)

---

The thing about that game I like is that it's sort of a small world that you can explore at your own leisure, if a bit linear. It is a kind of peaceful, and the music gives everything a bit of a unique ambience. But it's peaceful because it's unfinished. There were meant to be random encounters. I prefer it without them.

So I've been thinking...Guan's Island is hardly a game that warrants much attention by critical/advancing-the-medium standards. Still I think about it regularly. I know that professional opinion shouldn't overrule mine, but...still? I feel like it's an interesting example of (accidentally) ditching genre staples.

Which I guess brings me to a sort of point: Genres in games are weird haphazard constructions, and I feel like a result of that is that random bits get copied and incorporated from the genre defining games just because. I've heard the term "Earthbound-like" which seems to revolve around copying wonky aesthetics with narrative mood swings. Couldn't you do both those things with another style of game, even though nobody would compare it to Earthbound? Are those two the game's entire genius?

Similarly with other mediums. I have difficulty keeping vaporwave music apart, it's so similar. The accompanying aesthetic is more or less "pink/cyan with floating random things, and also one of those must be a statue or bust" like the genre started and ended with one album.

I suspect that my point is unclear or missing, but I'm wondering about the way people make genres. It doesn't seem useful to me...

____________________
"Rusted old machines should stay home and play with their toasters!"

sofi

🌠
Level: 116


Posts: 3873/4152
EXP: 17115049
For next: 209044

Since: 02-18-11

Pronouns: she/her
From: たまごっち星

Since last post: 11 days
Last activity: 1 day

Posted on 06-17-19 09:20:18 PM Link | Quote
think they emerged initially just out of communities/localities and the practice of art criticism and now particularly in the case of music have shifted into being labels for commodification, if you get me. anyway that's my €0,02 on the matter

____________________
sofi
RanAS
Member
Level: 55


Posts: 641/845
EXP: 1291022
For next: 23167

Since: 10-10-14

From: São Paulo, Brazil

Since last post: 3 days
Last activity: 1 day

Posted on 06-29-19 12:32:10 PM Link | Quote
this post has no beginning and no end

Usually people will take inspiration from some earlier game from the same genre that has already worked well in the past (don't fix what ain't broken, they say!). Certain changes in these genres can be meaningful and make an impact on the person that's playing the game, who may want to replicate it, improve upon it, adapt it with something else already on their mind, or at the very least imitate it for a quick buck.

Games that follow the general rules of Metroid can be described as Metroid-like. And when Castlevania adapted some of the elements that were in Metroid games, then it became Metroidvania, a new classification for many recent games. On another note, there's recent games like Baba Is You which I personally believe to be a revolution on the scope of puzzle games.

But then there's stuff like The Stanley Parable, Thomas was Alone and The Beginner's Guide which even though they all belong to a certain "genre" they follow mostly nothing about it. They're just, their own thing.

I guess what I mean to say is, I like it more when a derivative work builds upon or uses a source as its base, rather than when a derivative work is limited by the boundaries that the source gives it. I like stuff that open's peoples eyes to something new and that lets them continue going forward, not something that opens their eyes only to close them again.

Our imagination is full of incredible amounts of possibilities and sometimes it's difficult for us all to make grab something that was imagined and turn it into something concrete that can be placed in a game, something that makes sense. Looking at references is really helpful with that.

-------

I really like the idea of games where you'd want to just explore. I always wanted to go beyond the barriers of N64 games like Paper Mario, Banjo-Kazooie, Ocarina of Time, and see just what is out there. Unfortunately, that's not how games work...

A problem I've had with some open-world games is that they're largely empty. I guess that's necessary for a person not to get completely overwhelmed by everything around them, but I feel like it misses a bit of what makes exploration fun. The world is full of interesting things and sometimes it's fun to travel just to see what there is to see. It's about the journey, not the destination. So the journey must also be interesting, not just bland filler. And the lack of enemies in this stage of the game just makes exploration that much easier.

It could be boring, but I think it has the potential to be quite peaceful and relaxing. Some things can be enjoyable just because of the atmosphere they bring. For example: Playdead's INSIDE (CW: this game can be gruesome at times), even if it's not as exploration heavy as it could be, its atmosphere and scenery is absolutely amazing.

____________________

"The quieter you become, the more you are able to hear." --Ram Dass
hydra-calm
Member
Level: 30


Posts: 226/249
EXP: 164270
For next: 1599

Since: 07-21-17


Since last post: 1.4 years
Last activity: 1.1 years

Posted on 06-29-19 04:46:24 PM (last edited by hydra-calm at 06-29-19 04:55:38 PM) Link | Quote
The drive to explore is the only reason I progressed in a lot of games as a kid. Golden Sun in particular was great at motivating exploration -- better than a lot of similar JRPGs, IMO. I guess that means I agree with Ran here mostly? The open-world thing rings true as well -- if the different parts of the world you're exploring are indistinguishable and the density/variety of significant objects/terrain/whatever is very low (things like TWW's sea that are barren areas separating very dense ones bother me less), then exploration isn't very rewarding.

That tangent aside, I think genres are inevitable with any media like this -- people's efforts are going to attract people w/ similar ideas, all the nastier parts of the medium asideI do agree there are a lot of disappointingly derivative works each time someone has a halfway original idea though, e.g. the huge pile of Yume Nikki clones. Yume Nikki specifically is a pretty sore point for me, actually -- "2D game focused on exploration w/ passive storytelling, almost no dialogue, and surreal art style" is a pretty loose category, but the majority of what people seem to have made after/in reaction to it just amounts to a shitty YN "expansion pack" without half the atmosphere of the original game.
Next newer thread | Next older thread
Jul - Gaming - Genre staples New poll - New thread - New reply


Rusted Logic

Acmlmboard - commit 47be4dc [2021-08-23]
©2000-2022 Acmlm, Xkeeper, Kaito Sinclaire, et al.

30 database queries.
Query execution time: 0.085968 seconds
Script execution time: 0.011773 seconds
Total render time: 0.097741 seconds