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| Jul - Gaming - OpenPoké dev/discuss thread |
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Deleted User
Collection of nobodies
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| Diamond and Pearl started to break the convention by having NPCs in propercase, and people have asked me to break it completely. Repeatedly. So I did. ____________________ =================== [Posted by Kawa] |
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Shadic Alakadoof? Level: 151      Posts: 872/6929 EXP: 42379899 For next: 916577 Since: 07-22-07 Pronouns: he/him From: Olympia, WA Since last post: 6 days Last activity: 1 day
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Erika Catgirl 미안합니다 Level: 68 Posts: 31/1088 EXP: 2637648 For next: 91152 Since: 07-19-07 Since last post: 9.5 years Last activity: 9.3 years
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| Making it inconsistant with data and existing Pokemon from current games, which goes against the original fundamental goal of compatibility... I don't know I just think it's stupid, even DP kept it in all-caps for the exact same reason. But if you don't mind your game looking sloppy because interacting with other games will show mixed-case Pokemon.... |
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Darkdata Ruins!? ♥ Level: 103  Posts: 287/2892 EXP: 11446650 For next: 24756 Since: 07-04-07 Since last post: 203 days Last activity: 11 days
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  DPP - [internet://board/post287.bit] - 10-23-07 10:11:04 PM  When trading is worked out the data could be changed to fit the cases of both games. Check original name of Pokèmon, if match convert proper of receiving the Pokémon or convert to uppercase before trading.
I always wondered why that was not done in pearl also. And even if above can not be accomplished like that... there could also be an option for the name rater to override a traded pokemon's name. Openpoke will be opensource after all, and anyone who wants to upper/lower/mix their cases would be free to do so. Of course this could all be blind useless guessing, right? 
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Rena I had one (1) message in Discord deleted and proceeded to make a huge, huge mess about how it was a violation of free speech and how moderators are supposed to be spam janitors and nobody should have the right to tell me not to talk about school shootings Level: 135 Posts: 1372/5390 EXP: 29077075 For next: 257930 Since: 07-22-07 Pronouns: he/him/whatever From: RSP Segment 6 Since last post: 342 days Last activity: 342 days
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JL2 - Post #1372 - 10-23-07 05:45:35 PM Day 93, rank 7; Level 42 (26.4%) 10891/41217 (491036/521362)
GPP: 536; GT: 32.855 Originally posted by ErikaNot like it's going to break anything. It'll just look like you named them all that way when you caught them.  ____________________ Why not to buy from: Sony, Philips | The file Microsoft shut down my web site for How this layout should look | BSFree - Codes without the bullshit DS Homebrew | Hilarity | WTF | More hilarity | Free office suite | 7zip | NirSoft |
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Erika Catgirl 미안합니다 Level: 68 Posts: 36/1088 EXP: 2637648 For next: 91152 Since: 07-19-07 Since last post: 9.5 years Last activity: 9.3 years
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Originally posted by Darkdata It wasn't done in Pearl because something like this is impractical. Someone could by hand name a pokemon BULBASAUR (which would mean when it evolves it is still called BULBASAUR, but, still) and if the game detected it, it would change to Bulbasaur? That's a horrible idea, and there is no way to check if it is a nickname or not in that sort of thing. And if you made the name-rater rename traded Pokemon, you would need to rename it every time it evolved to get the right case...uh what the heck? The whole reason you can't rename traded Pokemon anyway is because Satoshi Tajiri wanted players to have that feeling of a Pokemon being personal and not just another peice of data in a game, it was meant so that a Pokemon could be like a real part of the trainer and a Pokemon's name would just be a part of that trainer that went with the Pokemon. I think it was a really interesting concept =\ There were so many little details to what made Pokemon...well, Pokemon, it just doesn't seem like that's getting captured.. As for it being open source, that doesn't matter, the engine was supposed to be accurate and consistant. That was the entire point of the project in the first place. But that stopped mattering a loooong time ago, of course, this project is so far from any of that its not funny. And HyperHacker, it doesn't matter if it won't break anything, it just looks sloppy. It's poor game design, and that's EXACTLY why it was kept in DP. Gamefreak and the NOA translation team wanted to be consistant with their own game data, it wouldn't make any sense at all to do it otherwise. It's just an established naming convention, so there would be no point in changing it in a project that was meant to be consistent and accurate  it's just...sloppy. |
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No, having the names be in all caps is stupid and should be changed.Originally posted by ErikaWhat? ____________________ =================== [Posted by NightKev] |
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Erika Catgirl 미안합니다 Level: 68 Posts: 37/1088 EXP: 2637648 For next: 91152 Since: 07-19-07 Since last post: 9.5 years Last activity: 9.3 years
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| It shouldn't be changed. It might have been stupid but it became a convention, and conventions are meant to be KEEPED, especially to maintain consitancy between other mediums also using the same convention.
As for my other comment, yeah, the project at this point is so far from my own vision of accuracy towards the original engine and format. The original point of the project was supposed to be to reverse-engineer the game and create an open-source engine as identical as possible to that which the game developers themselves used (basically as a learning experience for myself, but ). This is....not even close to that. |
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Skreeny Member I have a custom title. Level: 54  Posts: 118/636 EXP: 1172602 For next: 61268 Since: 09-15-07 Since last post: 9.3 years Last activity: 1.2 years
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Originally posted by ErikaThis is untrue. I just tested it with a Clefairy that I named "CLEFAIRY". It... turned into CLEFABLE. The original games THEMSELVES couldn't detect if a name identical to species name was a nickname or not; why should a clone do it? |
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Erika Catgirl 미안합니다 Level: 68 Posts: 38/1088 EXP: 2637648 For next: 91152 Since: 07-19-07 Since last post: 9.5 years Last activity: 9.3 years
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| Name a CLEFAIRY something like Bob. Go to the name rater. Change it to CLEFAIRY. Go back and evolve it. It's still CLEFAIRY. If you enter it as CLEFAIRY when you catch it the game realizes that you didn't actually change anything. If the clone named the Pokemon Clefairy by default and used the same name detection mechanizm as the real game (...lol), Pokemon traded in as CLEFAIRY would != Clefairy and be seen as a nickname. In pearl, if you have a Japanese PIKACHU that is unnamed, the Japanese name becomes an english RAICHU. If you nicknamed it PIKACHU or even Pikachu in the Japanese games, trading it over would make it keep this name even in evolution. See what I am saying? Plus how stupid would it look to see PIKACHU evolve in to Raichu? It's just sloppy and that's exactly why I'm saying this game should not do it =\ |
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Skreeny Member I have a custom title. Level: 54 Posts: 119/636 EXP: 1172602 For next: 61268 Since: 09-15-07 Since last post: 9.3 years Last activity: 1.2 years
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| Umm, no. I just went and renamed the same Clefairy (yeah, I don't save my experiments) to Bob. I renamed it CLEFAIRY. It evolved. It's... CLEFABLE again.
The reason that P I K A C H U doesn't rename itself to RAICHU upon evolution is that it's a completely different name. The Japanese-English font is separate from the English English font. |
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Erika Catgirl 미안합니다 Level: 68 Posts: 39/1088 EXP: 2637648 For next: 91152 Since: 07-19-07 Since last post: 9.5 years Last activity: 9.3 years
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| That's not the point though, it's still considered a nickname. The Japanese font is still in the english game, if you used a cheating device to enter its Japanese name and sent it over to a Japanese pearl it would not evolve in to RAICHU with Japanese characters. Think of it as that kind of example. Either way, my point still remains that it is a sloppy practice to go against any kind of naming convention established accross multiple games, no matter how much you may disagree with said convention (its a convention for a reason--its how the original game designers intended for it to be, and if this project was attempting to be accurate as such it would not go against the developer's desired conventions, which was my point basically)
Even if DP went and "broke convention" by using proper case for items, npcs and attacks (not bearing in mind that some attacks had no spaces between words and looked really stupid in proper case), this is the GBA engine, whose conventions say that ESPECIALLY Pokemon names are capitalized.... |
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Deleted User
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| Okay, first things first. OpenPoké is ASCII compliant. Has been so since the beginning. A traded Pokémon would be translated from/to whatever you want to call it to/from ASCII.
If a traded monster is a Pikachu named... "SPARKY", it would evolve to a Raichu named "SPARKY". Same if it's "Sparky". That's the easy case. If a traded monster is a Pikachu named "PIKACHU" (the default), it would evolve to a Raichu... the name would be compared to "Pikachu" first because it's easy. It doesn't match, so we try comparing it to "PIKACHU", an uppercase string generated on the spot from the species list. It matches. We know by now if it's proper or upper case, so we can rename it to "RAICHU" -or- "Raichu" appropriately. And did you ever stop to think about the German and French and god knows what other translations of the official game? What if you traded your German Skitty named "ENECO" to an English game? Would it be detected and renamed "DELCATTY"? I couldn't find the other names in my rom, so I doubt it. So kindly stop arguing and start assuming I think about compatibility issues before I cause them. PS: In case you missed it, you've been arguing over the renaming of individual monsters, which is not my intention at all. On a completely different note, today marks the finding of the alignment data for monsters in battle. At 2349CC and 235E6C are the coordinates for front and back respectively. It's in a byte-byte-padding struct, where the first byte is the height and the second is... whatever. Fronts start at 8 and backs at 48, add that byte to it to find the sprite's Y coordinate. ____________________ =================== [Posted by Kawa] |
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Rena I had one (1) message in Discord deleted and proceeded to make a huge, huge mess about how it was a violation of free speech and how moderators are supposed to be spam janitors and nobody should have the right to tell me not to talk about school shootings Level: 135 Posts: 1387/5390 EXP: 29077075 For next: 257930 Since: 07-22-07 Pronouns: he/him/whatever From: RSP Segment 6 Since last post: 342 days Last activity: 342 days
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JL2 - Post #1387 - 10-24-07 01:59:27 PM Day 94, rank 7; Level 42 (51.5%) 21214/41217 (501359/521362)
GPP: 542; GT: 32.469 Originally posted by KyoufuKittyWait, you can trade between different languages now? ____________________ Why not to buy from: Sony, Philips | The file Microsoft shut down my web site for How this layout should look | BSFree - Codes without the bullshit DS Homebrew | Hilarity | WTF | More hilarity | Free office suite | 7zip | NirSoft |
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Deleted User
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| I dunno, never tried. But the presence of support for Japanese text suggests language barriers in general aren't very important. ____________________ =================== [Posted by Kawa] |
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Erika Catgirl 미안합니다 Level: 68 Posts: 40/1088 EXP: 2637648 For next: 91152 Since: 07-19-07 Since last post: 9.5 years Last activity: 9.3 years
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| As of GBA generation I believe you could trade between Japan and US games, in fact I am VERY certain and the names carry over...and I do not believe it was compatible with the EU games, however....I beleive it just would not work. But the Japanese and even European font is in the US games, so take it as you would like to take it o-o;; |
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Originally posted by ErikaYou might want to realize that pretty much everyone else wants it changed to proper capitalization (unless you can prove otherwise?). Therefore, it makes sense to change it. ____________________ =================== [Posted by NightKev] |
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Erika Catgirl 미안합니다 Level: 68 Posts: 41/1088 EXP: 2637648 For next: 91152 Since: 07-19-07 Since last post: 9.5 years Last activity: 9.3 years
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| Well then they can do it themself, but for the purpose of the engine itself it should be conventional, which was my whole point in the first plaaaaace. Being as its open source, anyone who likes it in any other format can do that. |
Someguy Shyguy Level: 23 Posts: 12/92 EXP: 64814 For next: 2909 Since: 07-26-07 Pronouns: he/him From: California now! Since last post: 4.4 years Last activity: 23 hours
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Originally posted by Erika I don't want to get in the middle of things, I just wanted to say that using emulators one time I did trade between Japanese and American versions of Advance Generation Pokemon games properly. ____________________ The other Someguy. |
Xenesis Roy Koopa Actually a Doctor Level: 101  Posts: 32/2732 EXP: 10487212 For next: 230463 Since: 07-28-07 Pronouns: She/Her From: Orange Star's Retirement Villa Since last post: 10 days Last activity: 10 hours
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| As far as foreign names go, I can only speak for DP...
Thanks to the magic of the GTS, I discovered something. If the Pokemon's Nickname is identical to the Species name for the region it was from (Eg, Jp Pikachu as 'Pikachu') if you evolve it in a different language game it'll 'fix' it's name to match the species name for the version you're playing on. |
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| Jul - Gaming - OpenPoké dev/discuss thread |
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Acmlmboard - commit 47be4dc [2021-08-23]
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