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05-04-22 08:03:55 PM
Jul - Gaming - Fifth Generation of s/Heroes/Pokemon/ New poll - New thread - New reply
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Gabu

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Posted on 02-10-10 11:28:11 PM (last edited by Gabu at 02-10-10 08:29 PM) Link | Quote
Originally posted by midori no kaze
Plus I don't like the from on four legs -> on two legs thing. :/


So you don't like Garurumon -> Weregarurumon?

I know it's the wrong franchise, but still kinda fits.


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Posted on 02-11-10 12:05:13 AM (last edited by Schala at 02-10-10 10:12 PM) Link | Quote
Some type combinations would flat-out suck, but I can think of a few that are at least usable:

- Steel/Poison: Only two weaknesses, Fire (2x) and Ground (4x), and the typing cancels out Psychic and Fighting weaknesses.
- Electric/Grass: Electric's Ground weakness gets canceled out by Grass, but you then gain a weakness to Bug, Poison, Ice and Fire. =/
- Psychic/Dark: Immune to Psychic, neutral Dark and Fighting... but it has a 4x Bug weakness...

I would like to see at least one of these in the future Pokémon generation. =D

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Red Lord
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Posted on 02-11-10 01:04:18 AM (last edited by Red Lord at 02-10-10 10:24 PM) Link | Quote

I really like Zorua's design, but Zoroark just looks plain weird. Not to mention his standing up pose looks really familiar. I also think his flowing long hair is a bit much, especially since it has a blue bead in it.

Hopefully they are actually giving Zoroark a Fighting/Dark type, since he looks to be as such. Not to mention, he would only be weak against Bug and Flying.

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Posted on 02-11-10 04:47:40 AM Link | Quote
Originally posted by Keitaro
Just because it's something you don't like to do doesn't mean its pointless. If you play the game normally you'll have pretty regular stats, anyway, so who cares? If you aren't going to do any competitive battling you probably won't even encounter those people who EV train since they'd have no interest in fighting you! If you are going to complain about people hacking or using legit EV trained Pokemon on Wi-fi...well, what did you expect.

Yeah, see, this is the problem. I DO want to be able to play with other people online, I just don't want to have to waste 40+ hours getting just one pokemon perfectly right to be able to do so.

I live in a place called sweden where any one over the age of 10 that still plays pokemon gets beaten down to the pulp, no kidding. So I was damn exciting about the online play so I could finally be able to fight people online. Turns out, not many people I know are terrible into it like me, so I join a few pokemon communites (hell I was even in a clan at one point) but, woppeee fucking do, I have to spend several hours breeding to just get the right IVs? And no, don't give me that bullshit, there is no way in-game to see what IVs your pokemons have, it's clearly there to make each pokemon unique not for people to mass breed and get the right one. I can understand natures, fine, maybe even EVs if you feed your pokemons energy items. But IVs are not meant to play around with to get the best pokemon. V_v;

The things that get me about EVs is that you get X type Y effort point from killing Z pokemon. And there is no way of telling that in-game. So if nintendo game freak did support it, would there not be a way to see that?

The energy items have been around since gen one, and they clearly state what they boost.

The training items are new, they clearly state what they boost just like the energy items, just not in what way. (It doubles effort points to certain stat or all of them)

But I don't mind those two, as the game clearly tells you what they do. But here comes the problem, energy items are expensive as fuck. And so are most training items as far as I can tell.
So either you have to:
1. Grind cash, or
2. Grind a certain pokemon that you know what stat they help boosting.

Both are not only extremely boring to do, they take forever, and how would you know what effort points you get without looking in the freaking code? (Or at online site that have already done that)


The point is, I can keep bitching about why I hate EV and IV training forever really, but in the end it's players choice what way to play the damn game. My problem, however, is that it ruins it for people like me that don't want to play the game like that, as I have no one to freaking play with. V_v;

----------

Gabu: That's also one that looks really bad.
I can understand going from four legs to two legs if it's done well, but I certainly don't think it is in both this case and the case you showed. :/

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Posted on 02-11-10 06:32:12 AM Link | Quote
midori: It ruins the game because you don't want to play it.

Pokemon is one of the best fuses between pro-gaming and casual gaming that there is, EVER. And as for you guys using hacked pokemons over Wi-Fi, you're part of a big problem.

Personally I never got into the pro-scene of pokemon, but I can definitely see a well executed game system when I see it.

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Skreeny
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Posted on 02-11-10 06:37:42 AM Link | Quote
They may not give you the exact numbers, but since D/P, they've been adding more and more ways to control and/or understand both EVs and IVs. Power items (apparently HG/SS expand them to allowing you to pass the specific IV in that stat down to the egg), the effort ribbon, characteristics, that guy in the Battle Tower who specifically tells you how good the best IV on your Pokemon is, Hidden Power (for that matter, the guy in Platinum's Game Corner who will tell you what type it'd be), berries to reduce a given EV, etc. Arguing that they want you specifically not to use any of this information is somewhat... unfounded.
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Posted on 02-11-10 11:17:44 AM (last edited by Xenesis at 02-11-10 08:21 AM) Link | Quote
The IV system is borked because there's no advantage to disadvantage tradeoff. More IVs is always better (unless you really really really need a specific hidden power, then you lose 1 or 2 IV points at most). Until there's a disadvantage for having higher IVs, there'll always be a need to breed/hack for 31IV pokemon.

Pokemon is a terrible competitive game anyhow - You have to spend hours grinding before you can do anything that approaches competitive play. If you don't do the prerequisite preparationgrinding you've lost before your match has begun. As a casual competitive game it sucks arse too because the power level between teams horridly mismatches easily leading to massive sweeps. The sims like shoddybattle are the only thing that makes pokemon playable vs other people really, because it removes the single player requirement from the multiplayer.

For a game that blends casual and competitive play really well, look at Team Fortress 2.

Pokemon does none of the things that make the game accessible at a low and a high level.

But then, I've felt that pokemon needs an earth-shattering rebuild from the ground up but it won't get it as all the changes since Gen 2 have been really conservative.
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Posted on 02-11-10 05:15:26 PM (last edited by Boing at 02-11-10 02:20 PM) Link | Quote
I've done some competitive battling in Gen 4, but granted that was in a simulator, so I didn't have to really work for it!

When it comes down to it, Pokemon is a game with a ton of strategy and is very fun competitively. The only problem with it is how hard it is to actually OBTAIN competitive pokemon. If they introduced a way to make training pokemon less painstaking there would be less hacking and more people would probably enjoy it overall.

As far as battle mechanics... I really think Gen 4 nailed everything. Perhaps they should nerf Stealth Rock a bit, though.

Edit: Schala: Dark/Ghost has no weaknesses! But obviously it would break the game if they gave any pokemon with this typing decent stats.

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Posted on 02-11-10 05:33:08 PM (last edited by midori no kaze at 02-11-10 02:40 PM) Link | Quote
I think Boing just nailed my point better then what I did with my whole rant. ;

As for new games I hope they try some new things with the layout of the game. To be honest I don't mind the whole "go beat eight gyms then kick the E4s arse" but I want more freedom in the game.

Rather then having a set path on where to go and such there are many route options to take and extra areas you don't have to play (and the game don't count on you doing all so you have the option to over level) so it adds more variation. If you look at any pokemon game map there is clearly routes where you can go and such, what about the rest of the freaking world? I'm sure this would help in placing pokemons too, as it would add to the fun part of finding where they hide and such rather then going the way D/P/Pt did. (Same pokemons half the game then like, shit many after E4 and many of them just came on randomly and infested a random route.)

It's not that I don't think game freak knows how to make a game that sells. But there is much improvements that can be made without killing the core game! =)

As far as pokemons go, I can agree that we have more then enough of them already... but on the same time there is something exciting about exploring a pokemon game and meet all new monsters you have never seen before!

Also, get rid of the zubat + geodude cave deal. It's stupid now and I got sick of it after gen1. V_v;


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Keitaro

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Posted on 02-11-10 05:51:53 PM Link | Quote
Well, what else are you going to have in a cave? Would you rather they just make a new bat/rock Pokemon that would essentially take the same role? Not many things live in caves....rocks, bats, occasionally bears, they have all of these things. I just fail to see the problem is all its no more annoying than going in to a field and finding that particular gen's bird/plant of choice. As for dark/ghost being broken, well...Sableye kinda sucks and Spiritomb is far from broken, albiet a decent Pokemon in its own right.
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Posted on 02-11-10 06:18:26 PM Link | Quote
It's just the lack of variation, that's all.

R/S/E did this kinda right. First cave in the game only got one pokemon in it, true, but it's not zubat or geodude that I'm so sick of seeing already and it's only two screens. The next cave do have zubats but there is much more variation so it's still fine. And like the cave near the volcano got fire types and poison types in it. =)

It's not that I hate zubats and geodude per se, it's just that I'm sick if that match up and how often they show up in caves. They did bring that back on a bigger scale in gen4 so that's why I got a big sick of it. (I do in fact have a geodude trained and evolved into prime form. =) )

Replacement would be okay I guess, but I would rather see more variation in the caves. When you got such a long list of monsters it really should not be that hard me thinks.

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Posted on 02-11-10 09:50:14 PM Link | Quote
Supakitsune
One big idea I had for a new Pokemon game would be to take the "16 badges" thing from G/S/C and work with it a little more. Instead of it being 8 badges -> E4 -> 8 badges -> vs. champ, you'd go through 16 badges. This would mean creating a much larger, more expansive world, but it'd be so worth it. For one thing, they could use a lot more Pokemon from past generations in conjunction with these newer ones; a regional Pokedex could be closer to 300 than 150. The levels would be somewhat balanced out so that you can't have a bunch of Lv100s rampaging by the time you hit, say, the 10th badge or so, but in return, the Elites would have something closer to Red's Pokemon's levels in G/S/C, and the Champion would have near Lv100 Pokemon. And then, of course, you'd have a nice Battle Frontier to challenge as well.

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Posted on 02-11-10 09:53:15 PM Link | Quote
Yeah I never understood the point of beating the E4 and your pokemons where like around 60. Then extra trainers max levels are like 70. There really need to be a way to get them up to level 100 without grinding. V_v;

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Posted on 02-11-10 10:44:52 PM Link | Quote
If they just added level balancing to local wireless, there would be almost no benefit (hello Mewtwo!) to reaching level 100. Much of the in-game extra content (Battle Frontier and what not) levels you back down to level 50, anyway...

I always view "leveling beyond what is required to beat the game" to be something you can do if you want, but not something the game needs to encourage. At least now you can buy rare candy, or find it with Pickup (say, when you're chaining for shinies).
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Posted on 02-12-10 12:00:16 AM Link | Quote
You can buy rare candy? The hell? I don't recall any game that had this. Rare candies are pointless anyway as they raise your level but not your stats, so you could in theory give a level 1 Pidgey 100 rare candies and it would be no stronger than when you caught it (and now can never get stronger because you maxed its level ) the only time I've ever used my rare candies in game was when I was filling my Pokedex and got too impatient on a couple of evolutions. Even then I'd limit the use to about one per Pokemon so I'd still give myself something to do
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Posted on 02-12-10 12:03:10 AM Link | Quote
Supakitsune
Originally posted by Keitaro
You can buy rare candy? The hell? I don't recall any game that had this. Rare candies are pointless anyway as they raise your level but not your stats, so you could in theory give a level 1 Pidgey 100 rare candies and it would be no stronger than when you caught it (and now can never get stronger because you maxed its level ) the only time I've ever used my rare candies in game was when I was filling my Pokedex and got too impatient on a couple of evolutions. Even then I'd limit the use to about one per Pokemon so I'd still give myself something to do
Apparently you can buy them for an inflated price in HeartGold/SoulSilver...

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Posted on 02-12-10 12:36:24 AM Link | Quote
Whatever they do, there's one thing I want:

Buy several cans of lemonade at once.

If I have to spend ten minutes pressing A-DOWN-DOWN-A-A repeatedly to empty the vending machines any more I'll get insane and go on a rampage through towns with my underleveled non-evolved pokemon.

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Posted on 02-12-10 12:38:56 AM (last edited by Skreeny at 02-11-10 09:41 PM) Link | Quote
Originally posted by Keitaro
You can buy rare candy? The hell? I don't recall any game that had this. Rare candies are pointless anyway as they raise your level but not your stats, so you could in theory give a level 1 Pidgey 100 rare candies and it would be no stronger than when you caught it (and now can never get stronger because you maxed its level ) the only time I've ever used my rare candies in game was when I was filling my Pokedex and got too impatient on a couple of evolutions. Even then I'd limit the use to about one per Pokemon so I'd still give myself something to do
Rare candies raise stats but not EVs, same as the day care people. Level 100 rare candy Pidgey will be weaker than trained Pidgey, but it will be stronger than the same Pidgey if it was encountered in the wild at level 99. This also means that if you max out the Pokemon's EVs (you can get the effort ribbon in Canalave at this point), you can Rare Candy it up to your heart's content. Or put the Pokemon in the daycare center, find a muddy slope, tape the "up" arrow down, and leave the game running however long it takes.

Also, Battle Tower (D/P) or Frontier (Pt). 48 Battle Points per candy. Alternately 2000 points in the Pokeathlon Dome.

(Incidentally, if you track a Pokemon's stat gains over several levels while raising it with only Rare Candy and vitamins, you can use this data to calculate its IVs.)

...I'm amused by math. This makes Pokemon very good for me.


EDIT: Since that last post showed up while I was typing this, as long as HG/SS is like Gold and Silver, you can buy large quantities of Lemonade at once at Mt Moon Square, as long as you visit between 10 AM and 6 PM.
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Jul - Gaming - Fifth Generation of s/Heroes/Pokemon/ New poll - New thread - New reply


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