gamekrazzy
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| Posted on 05-27-09 02:41:43 PM (last edited by Metal_Man88 at 07-12-09 05:08 PM) |
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Originally posted by vinnyboiler
...beta metal wing cap Mario...
Metal Wing Cap Mario isn't beta... Wrong, they ARE Beta. Read VL-tone's post for details. -MM88
But as for the beta, lets not forget the beta fire flower...
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messiaen
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| Posted on 05-27-09 04:50:01 PM |
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RomanianGirl: There are some programs that can create lists of strings (text) in the ROM, such as IDA Pro, they are very useful.
Talking about beta/unused stuff, a while ago Yoshielectron (yoshiman on this forum) found a "second" debug menu with five pages of info. Looking at a nearby area, I have also found this debug output. It's a function which isn't called from nowhere, I guess that at some point it was a Mario debug, but it doesn't work right.
(function at 0x802CB394) |
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| Posted on 05-27-09 05:31:59 PM |
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Since we are getting intrest from other sites, would it be better to create a page or use this form to describe about all the beta stuff in the game in detail. We can give images, functions and how we found the data.
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| Posted on 05-27-09 05:35:44 PM |
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Originally posted by vinnyboiler
Since we are getting intrest from other sites, would it be better to create a page or use this form to describe about all the beta stuff in the game in detail. We can give images, functions and how we found the data.
The purpose of having a forum is to have people visit it. Let them come. The more the merrier...
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Rez2
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| Posted on 05-27-09 07:33:48 PM (last edited by Metal_Man88 at 07-12-09 05:09 PM) |
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Originally posted by gamekrazzy
Originally posted by vinnyboiler
...beta metal wing cap Mario...
Metal Wing Cap Mario isn't beta... As said above, this line is wrong. Read VL-Tone's post below instead. -MM88
But as for the beta, lets not forget the beta fire flower...
I thought it was beta as you never normally get the metal cap and the wing cap...but then again, if you don't but when you use codes to get the caps, you can get a metal wing cap Mario, doesn't that mean at one point it was going to be possible to combine caps without codes? (why am I asking, that answer seems obvious) also, the beta trampoline was quite cool, I guess there must be loads of objects not found yet then. |
gamekrazzy
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| Posted on 05-27-09 09:42:55 PM (last edited by Metal_Man88 at 07-12-09 05:09 PM) |
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Actually it is possible without codes. Except it's impossible without hacking. You can use TT64 to have both a wing cap and a Metal Cap in a level. Meaning it really isn't beta, because it is programed into the game, The two items just were not put into the same area. It was programmed to where caps could be combined is what I am guessing because in the cheats I have used there is Invisible Wing Cap Mario, and Invisible Metal Mario. So there is probably an Invisible Metal Wing Cap Mario.
WRONG, WRONG, WRONG, IGNORE THIS--Read VL-Tone's post instead. -MM88
hmm that Debug screen looks pretty interesting Messian...
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| Posted on 05-27-09 10:54:45 PM (last edited by Metal_Man88 at 07-12-09 05:10 PM) |
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Originally posted by Rez2
I thought it was beta as you never normally get the metal cap and the wing cap...but then again, if you don't but when you use codes to get the caps, you can get a metal wing cap Mario, doesn't that mean at one point it was going to be possible to combine caps without codes? (why am I asking, that answer seems obvious) also, the beta trampoline was quite cool, I guess there must be loads of objects not found yet then.
It's not beta. It's more likely added to the game to ensure that if the player somehow obtained the Wing cap and metal cap, the game wouldn't crash.
This is wrong too. -MM88
Originally posted by messiaen
There are some programs that can create lists of strings (text) in the ROM, such as IDA Pro, they are very useful.
Aha, I see. Well if you're still interesting, I have the text file of it. I looked it over and I think it's slightly interesting, but nothing new.
There's a section that talks about "Yoshi_scene" and "car_scene". I believe car is a shortening for something else, however.
Originally posted by no one, this is just Mario Code
gdm_maketestdl yoshi_scene mscene mscene car_scene
gdm_maketestdl(): unknown dl
dlgen
gdm_gettestdl(): DL number %d undefined yoshi_scene
gdm_gettestdl(): DL number %d undefined yoshi_sh_l1
gdm_gettestdl(): DL number %d undefined car_scene testnet2
no memory for car DL
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Rez2
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| Posted on 05-28-09 01:10:42 PM |
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Originally posted by Romaniangirl
It's not beta. It's more likely added to the game to ensure that if the player somehow obtained the Wing cap and metal cap, the game wouldn't crash.
that seems pretty likely.
Originally posted by no one, this is just Mario Code
gdm_maketestdl yoshi_scene mscene mscene car_scene
gdm_maketestdl(): unknown dl
dlgen
gdm_gettestdl(): DL number %d undefined yoshi_scene
gdm_gettestdl(): DL number %d undefined yoshi_sh_l1
gdm_gettestdl(): DL number %d undefined car_scene testnet2
no memory for car DL
Character? if it was right next to the yoshi_scene bit, then maybe its part of the "yoshi scene"? my ideas sound stupid don't they... |
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| Posted on 05-28-09 01:31:43 PM |
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Originally posted by gamekrazzy
probably an Invisible Metal Wing Cap Mario..
Yes, I used the values for that when I used the cap modifier for messing around.
I don't think it could crash the game. The "filters" applied to Mario's graphics to indicate active caps are independent of each other.
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gamekrazzy
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| Posted on 05-28-09 09:20:45 PM (last edited by Metal_Man88 at 07-12-09 05:11 PM) |
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Originally posted by Hectamatatortron
Originally posted by gamekrazzy
probably an Invisible Metal Wing Cap Mario..
Yes, I used the values for that when I used the cap modifier for messing around.
I don't think it could crash the game. The "filters" applied to Mario's graphics to indicate active caps are independent of each other.
So the caps were made so that if someone by chance got more then one cap together then the game would not error, and it would just have both powers. Or all three.
Nope. -MM88
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| Posted on 05-28-09 09:52:03 PM (last edited by vinnyboiler at 05-28-09 06:53 PM) |
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| What I meant by the beta wing metal cap Mario is that their is a metal wings texture, Nintendo may of made the filter effect work with the all the caps but then why would the go thou all that trouble to make the metal wings texture to go along with the caps if they did not intend the metal and wing cap to be in the same level at some point during development of the game. |
Bob-omb8194
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| Posted on 05-28-09 10:05:24 PM (last edited by Bob-omb8194 at 05-28-09 07:18 PM) |
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| |  Originally posted by VL-Tone
Anyway, here's a little teaser for some other beta stuff I found:
More details soon. Good night 
About the red one, its actually a spiny shell missing spikes. When it comes to the green one, I have no clue, unless there were green ones. Its also possible that those were the origional versions of it, but they may haved threw them out and used the red for the spiny model.
Also:
Originally posted by RomanianGirl
There's a section that talks about "Yoshi_scene" and "car_scene". I believe car is a shortening for something else, however.
I'm guessing these were cut scenes like the opening and ending scenes. Yoshi could have had a scene once you found him. Car_scene probably stands for caracter scene. It may have been used during levels, like when something big happened, like in SM Sunshine, or SM Galaxy. Also, the metal flying cap was probably used for getting into water places out of normal reach. It has textures and graphics, so it was probably going to be in the game, like Yellow cap switch and other beta stuff.
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gamekrazzy
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| Posted on 05-28-09 10:06:37 PM (last edited by Metal_Man88 at 07-12-09 05:11 PM) |
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Originally posted by RomanianGirl
It's not beta. It's more likely added to the game to ensure that if the player somehow obtained the Wing cap and metal cap, the game wouldn't crash.
There is what I have to say vinnyboiler.
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VL-Tone
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| Posted on 05-29-09 04:40:35 AM (last edited by VL-Tone at 05-29-09 01:52 AM) |
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|  Time: Now - Date: Today - Weather: What can be seen outside. - Mood: How it feels. Answer to the universe: 42 | Originally posted by gamekrazzy
Originally posted by RomanianGirl
It's not beta. It's more likely added to the game to ensure that if the player somehow obtained the Wing cap and metal cap, the game wouldn't crash.
There is what I have to say vinnyboiler.
The Metal Wing Cap Mario not only has a separate geometry layout script, but it also has a completely separate and distinct metal wing texture.
It simply doesn't make sense to create a new texture and geo layout to prevent a supposed crash that would happen in an impossible situation (there's no way to "somehow" obtain both caps in the final game without a hack/code). It would've taken 2 lines of code to prevent two caps at the same time instead of going through all this trouble.
Even if your theory is true, it means that Nintendo had to test this scenario in a BETA test level where both caps were available, hence: the metal wing cap is beta stuff. This is what hidden Beta stuff is all about: things that were present at one moment or the other in the development Beta version and that's not normally accessible in the final version. Beta stuff is not limited to things that was intended to be in the final game.
Originally posted by Bob-omb8194
About the red one, its actually a spiny shell missing spikes. When it comes to the green one, I have no clue, unless there were green ones. Its also possible that those were the origional versions of it, but they may haved threw them out and used the red for the spiny model.
No they're not, spinny shells are in another bank completely, and the model is different in terms of vertex count and position, and aside from the obvious fact that those have spikes embedded in the geometry, spinny shells also have a yellow bottom, unlike these which have a light blue bottom.
I don't see how they could be the original version of spinny shells, since they don't have spikes...
This bank also doesn't contain any other spinny part (head or feets).
You can get these shells by replacing 0x22 commands in any level that can contain Goombas (Including Castle Grounds):
Red Shell
22 08 00 BE 0F 00 0A DC
Green Shell
22 08 00 C0 0F 00 0B 08
Or directly in TT64 by editing existing 0x22 commands:
Red Shell:
Bank ID=15 , Geo Layout Pointer=2780
Or in Hex: Bank ID=h0F , Geo Layout Pointer=h0ADC
Green Shell:
Bank ID=15 , Geo Layout Pointer=2824
Or in Hex: Bank ID=h0F , Geo Layout Pointer=h0B08
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Bob-omb8194
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| Posted on 05-29-09 11:34:59 PM (last edited by Bob-omb8194 at 05-29-09 09:18 PM) |
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| | They are different, looking at them. The shape just reminded me a lot of a spiny shell, due to the way the front of it was a little higher than the back, and the size. I also couldn't see the bottoms in the picture What I keep wondering about is why the bottom is blue. There may be a beta koopa or some other enemy in there as well, But I'm not sure...
Did spinys have heads though? I didn't think they did. I think the shells were going to be like the Super Mario Bros. shells. You kicked them and threw them.
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gamekrazzy
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| Posted on 05-30-09 04:20:16 AM (last edited by gamekrazzy at 05-30-09 01:24 AM) |
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hmmm. this seems appropriate to place here. Umm... I found this wierd occurance with King Bob-omb... Apparently like Yoshi, he gets effected by changing the level's 0x05 bank. I changed it so that I will add Tweesters here. What happened to be wierd though is I could not find anything that got affected by it. BTW the reason for the other unknow and stuff is because this is actually the Castle Grounds level, but I replaced the pointers. Umm... What I find wierd here is that it notices that it is King Bob-omb, but looks nothing like such. It's just a box. The game also freezes when I get to a certain point. I wonder if this means that they were planning on having King Bob-omb in Shifting Sand Land? Maybe I am wrong.
Anyways, this just seemed like an oppropriate place to post this. VL-Tone... Maybe this could simply be a place where people can post beta stuff they find. I just found that wierd, because normally I would get an unknown and, the object would be invisible. I wonder what it is.
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| Posted on 05-31-09 01:17:25 AM (last edited by vinnyboiler at 05-30-09 10:24 PM) |
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Was their not someone doing a beta hack that apparetly contacted Nintendo and found out from them that kooper shells were originally red.
If that was true then the kooper troopers might of been using that shell VL-tone found in the beta version.
If that shell don't work with the kooper troopers prohaps the kooper troopers may of have been reworked on before the games production line went gold.
Sorry if this sounds like rubbish, if I can do my own research then I most likely check this stuff myself. |
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| Posted on 05-31-09 11:10:55 AM |
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| these are very interesting finds but is there a thread for all the beta objects found so far with there offsets? |
VL-Tone
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| Posted on 05-31-09 10:18:47 PM (last edited by VL-Tone at 05-31-09 07:20 PM) |
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| Time: Now - Date: Today - Weather: What can be seen outside. - Mood: How it feels. Answer to the universe: 42 | Originally posted by gamekrazzy
hmmm. this seems appropriate to place here. Umm... I found this wierd occurance with King Bob-omb... Apparently like Yoshi, he gets effected by changing the level's 0x05 bank. I changed it so that I will add Tweesters here. What happened to be wierd though is I could not find anything that got affected by it. BTW the reason for the other unknow and stuff is because this is actually the Castle Grounds level, but I replaced the pointers. Umm... What I find wierd here is that it notices that it is King Bob-omb, but looks nothing like such. It's just a box. The game also freezes when I get to a certain point. I wonder if this means that they were planning on having King Bob-omb in Shifting Sand Land? Maybe I am wrong.
Anyways, this just seemed like an oppropriate place to post this. VL-Tone... Maybe this could simply be a place where people can post beta stuff they find. I just found that wierd, because normally I would get an unknown and, the object would be invisible. I wonder what it is.
Seriously gamekrazzy, you have this habit of posting very confusing questions...
Learn to separate your ideas into concise phrases.
After a few hours of reading your post, I think I finally understand what you mean and here's how your ideas should've been separated:
1. In Bob-Omb Battlefield, you swapped bank 0x05 with the bank from Shifting Sand Land that contains the Tweester.
2. King Bob-Omb is still there acting normally, but he's transformed into a glitched cube.
3. Some other stuff makes the game crash at some point.
The answer:
If you only switched bank 0x05, it means that you only swapped the polygon data and not the geo layout script (which is in bank 0x0C).
As I said before the Tweester is one of the very few objects that has its geo layout script inside the same bank as the polygon data, so you can make it appear in another level just by swapping bank 0x05.
Since you left the geo layout for King Bob-Omb and other objects, but changed the polygon bank, what happens is that the King Bob-Omb 0x15 or 0x13 geo layout commands (responsible for telling the game where the polygon data is) points to some area of the Tweester polygon bank in the middle of some other object's polygon commands, and that just happens to produce some glitched cube (maybe it's in the middle of the Tox Box polygon commands).
So there's nothing beta about this, you were just lucky that the command sequence that's randomly executed didn't crash the game for King Bob-Omb (though some other object seemingly does now point to a crashing command sequence).
Of course if you barely know what you're doing and experiment by changing things here and there, you can make weird stuff appear/happen in the game, but it doesn't mean it's beta stuff...
Originally posted by vinnyboiler
Was their not someone doing a beta hack that apparetly contacted Nintendo and found out from them that kooper shells were originally red.
If that was true then the kooper troopers might of been using that shell VL-tone found in the beta version.
If that shell don't work with the kooper troopers prohaps the kooper troopers may of have been reworked on before the games production line went gold.
Sorry if this sounds like rubbish, if I can do my own research then I most likely check this stuff myself.
While it's not impossible, I doubt that Nintendo would answer specific questions about beta stuff.
And these red and green shells are both using the same polygon data. So these are beta green and red shells. The green textured shell found in the final game is another model completely.
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