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12-11-17 03:56:21 AM

Jul - TCRF - The Cutting Room Wiki New poll - New thread - New reply
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Mattrizzle
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Posted on 03-18-10 11:31:15 AM (last edited by Mattrizzle at 03-18-10 11:32 AM) Link | Quote
I have a few questions:

  1. Where do multi-platform games fall into this? Should each version of the game be given its own individual page, or should only one of the versions count?

    I ask this because different ports of games can vary in the amount of unused stuff. For instance, data for Shaquille O'Neal exists in the Super Nintendo version of NBA Jam T.E., but is completely absent in the Sega Genesis version. However, the Genesis version has what Nintendon't data for several other unused players that don't exist in the SNES version. I think I just answered my own question here...

  2. Are data unused in one version of a game but used in versions released in other regions worth mentioning?

    I know, for example, that a track titled Move to the Mambo (track 0x18 in the USF) is used in the Japanese and European versions of Mario Party, but not in the North American version. In spite of this, it still exists in the NA ROM and was discovered by a GameShark code.


  3. If a game's sequel was built off the original game, are assets from the original game not used in the sequel important enough to be included? (i.e. SNES NBA Jam T.E. contains leftovers from NBA Jam)
Rick
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Posted on 03-19-10 01:41:39 AM Link | Quote
My personal thought is that if different platforms of the same game have different unused things in it, I don't see what the problem is with it. I know sometimes that games receive changes from platform to platform (check the rosters from the SNES and Genesis WWF Royal Rumble games, for example), so it might not be out of the question at all.

I'm not sure how to go about notating it properly though.
xdaniel
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Posted on 03-19-10 03:36:50 PM Link | Quote
Just want to add something regarding the Majora's Mask article...

"The Japanese version of Majora's Mask contains a test map that was removed from the American version. Currently there's no way to access it by normal means[...]"

Of course there is, 801EF462 00FF. Sure, it's still a GS code, but it's better than modifying a save state or whatever.

The cheat is even in Project64's cheat database as "Beta World 1", it's just that the exit list that's provided with it there doesn't list 0xFF to be the Test Map since - take a guess - the list has been made according to the US version of the game. Hell, that's how I found the map back then, messing with the code already in PJ64.
Liliana
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Posted on 03-19-10 05:24:16 PM Link | Quote
Thank you for refreshing my memories. I knew there was some easy way to get in there, but I messed with the map select for hours thinking it was somewhere in there, and it wasn't until later that I found the save state hidden well on my hard drive.

I'll add this information to the article.
xdaniel
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Posted on 03-29-10 02:10:36 PM Link | Quote
Another small addition: Ocarina of Time's Kokiri Forest scene 07, while used in part of the ending credits sequence, uses a very different actor layout, suggesting changes in the level geometry just like with Jabu-Jabu's unused data. You need to use the "Appear in Strange Places" code (8115F9C6 0001 for the Debug ROM), tho, since otherwise Link will not be loaded.



(Random observation, Appear in Strange Places seems to make Link appear at XYZ coordinates all 0, which for Kokiri Forest is inside the pillar with the girl and Rupee on top)
Liliana
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Posted on 03-29-10 02:16:20 PM Link | Quote
Yeah, Kokiri Forest's scene 07 is interesting. I skipped that one because you can actually see those masses of bushes and stones in the ending (the camera starts at Link's House and goes to the left, giving you a nice view). It might still be interesting to include.
Rena

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Posted on 03-29-10 06:45:59 PM Link | Quote
I get the feeling that code is something like forcing Link to load... you set this flag to 1 and Link appears at (0,0,0) (i.e. default/uninitialized location) when he otherwise wouldn't... what happens with other values?
Liliana
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Posted on 03-29-10 06:58:23 PM Link | Quote
At least when I used Appear in Strange Places, I never end up at 0,0,0...

What I believe it does is making the game think Link just fell into a void (it explains the sound, at least). This makes the game reload Link at the position he entered the room in... except he didn't enter the room yet, so the game seems to place Link in some random position.

Of course, this is just a theory and may not be true at all.
Peardian

  
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Posted on 04-06-10 02:35:58 AM Link | Quote
There's probably some stuff from Super Smash Bros. Brawl we could put up there. You know, unused character names, unused song filenames, Captain Falcon's unused cracked helmet textures, etc.
Xkeeper






Posted on 04-06-10 02:54:39 AM Link | Quote
That sounds like a good idea, yeah.
Rena

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Posted on 04-06-10 03:49:35 AM Link | Quote
Originally posted by Prince Kassad
At least when I used Appear in Strange Places, I never end up at 0,0,0...

What I believe it does is making the game think Link just fell into a void (it explains the sound, at least). This makes the game reload Link at the position he entered the room in... except he didn't enter the room yet, so the game seems to place Link in some random position.

Of course, this is just a theory and may not be true at all.
801DB378 0001 is the code to do that in v1.2. I used to use it with a button activator to escape if I got stuck anywhere. It plays the sound effect and warps you back to the entrance, taking damage. I don't know the proper offsets to port to the debug version though to see if it's the same code. IIRC without the button activator it would make the game unplayable, since you'd immediately warp back again as soon as you reappeared...
Of course there is also the possibility that when this flag is set, the code responsible for it eventually sets another flag that only causes Link to respawn at the entrance (or some other arbitrary location that it would set) without the effect. That would also explain why it doesn't become unplayable; the flag may be ignored if the respawn position is not set and/or only checked in certain situations.

If that's the case, AFAIK the Link object is never destroyed, or at least it's always recreated in the same memory location, so the most logical place for him to appear would be the location of the last exit he took (which may well be 0,0,0 if he hasn't ever spawned yet). Of course, even if the latter is true, in this scenario the object could end up in a different place because it's now being spawned last (after one frame of "gameplay" at which point the flag is checked) instead of first (during the level loading routine). However I recall hearing (though not confirming) that he's present somewhere off-screen during such scenes and even the file select screen, which would mean you could certainly tweak it back into "normal" mode and, with debug functions/cheats, fly around and maybe even find the menu floating in midair.
Liliana
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Posted on 04-06-10 06:28:53 PM Link | Quote
The code being active would not severely affect gameplay, since the subroutine is only triggered once during a transition. It would only cause you to, well, appear in strange places constantly.

I believe Link does start at the location of the last exit he took. But because he's now in a completely different map, those coordinates may be far away from the actual area. If you've used Appear in Strange Places to control Link in the ending dance, you may have noticed he always starts near the fence enclosing the horse area at the north side. Now, look where the entrance to Lon-Lon Ranch is in Hyrule Field, and you'll find a match.

Now, there are certain cutscenes where Link is not supposed to exist (the most prominent example is the Farore Cutscene). During these cutscenes, Link appears to be set to an "inactive" state: He still exists in the game world, but is invisible and cannot be controlled. You can still interact with the engine in this state (for example, activate the cutscene if you have the GameShark code for the Cutscene Activator enabled), but you cannot control Link in any way. Now, the Appear in Strange Places code forces Link to restart at some location, and incidentally also appears to return Link from the "disabled" state he's normally in, allowing you to control Link normally.

I believe the File Select screen is somewhere in Dodongo's Cavern. Sometimes codes that try to return you to the File Select screen instead make you end up in Dodongo's Cavern with a frozen Link...
xdaniel
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Posted on 04-16-10 04:21:13 PM Link | Quote
So, I've got 37 seperate images (minus 2 already on the Wiki) extracted from Star Fox 64, all of which aren't used by the game anymore. Some, like numbers from 0 to 9, might have copies in other files that are still used, but those copies apparently aren't. However, some of them are as small as 16 by 8 pixels, so uploading and posting them like this would be a bit of an annoying mess IMO.

Thus the question: Could I paste ex. related images (like the unused HUD elements) together into one image file? Or should I get over my lazyness and upload each image separately, so as to preserve how they were originally extracted, dimensions and all?
Xkeeper






Posted on 04-16-10 04:58:47 PM Link | Quote
for small shit like that (especially if it's obvious the graphics are a set), just put them next to each other with a 1 pixel gap horizontally or whatever, I guess.
Tauwasser
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Posted on 04-17-10 03:01:17 AM Link | Quote
What's so bad about uploading them with a proper name each separately? You can use galleries to blow them up a bit and have every use see them in their screen width. Combined images are always somewhat awkward, because you have to put them on their own line...

cYa,

Tauwasser
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Posted on 04-27-10 12:45:14 PM Link | Quote
just wondering but is Totaka's Song worth contrubuting to the wiki? since it's well hidden in so many games and one usage is unused
7HeroesForceBattle
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Posted on 05-11-10 03:01:30 AM Link | Quote
Not sure whether this is worth raising as an idea, or if it's already been mentioned, but...

Would the wiki be a good place to point out sections from developer interviews given to video game sites/magazines which mention features which were meant to be in the game but didn't end up in the final product?

The example I'm specifically thinking of (although there are no doubt hundreds) concerns early information on Castlevania: Order of Ecclesia (including at least one interview with IGA, I believe). It was reported that there would be weapons in the game which could be equipped "normally" and cost no MP to use. Those who have played the game are aware that this part of the equipment system was scrapped, and all "weapons" in the final game are just glyph spells which take MP to use.

To me, that's an interesting little tidbit - especially since recent Castlevania games have always struck me as going out of their way to please everyone. But I can't think of what the proper place would be to record this information so that other people who think like me could see it.

The only site I can think of that covers this kind of stuff as a medium-wide catch-all (as opposed to series/game-specific sites) is Unseen64. And, uh, I kind of hate how that site is designed.

Obviously it wouldn't really do to just set up a whole Ecclesia page for that, but it might make sense to have some for series and then perhaps alphabetical pages ("Interesting interview excerpts A").


(as an aside, this forum officially has the most amazing and distracting post customization I've ever seen)
Xkeeper






Posted on 05-11-10 04:36:45 AM Link | Quote
It can be toggled on and off in the Edit Profile page ("post layout"), and yes, it's quite different from most other forums


re: interviews, I don't really mind -- iirc we were going to have magazine scans/other images that show earlier versions of games too at some point... especially if we ever get the categorization system in the way I planned (as of now pretty much only antipiracy is actually there, but there are others; it's just kind of frustrating to get right)
DigitalBasic
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Posted on 05-17-10 11:35:29 AM Link | Quote
CAN WE ADD IN MORE ADMINS!?

Right now MM is editing all the pages to "Xk sucks" and shit and I am constantly restoring them, but I can't be assed to do it all day.
DigitalBasic
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Posted on 05-17-10 11:37:53 AM (last edited by cpubasic13 at 05-17-10 11:38 AM) Link | Quote
And by that I mean I have no fucking control over stopping him on the wiki. Just the board.
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