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05-24-18 12:37:01 AM

Jul - The Cutting Room Floor - ST II Turbo (weird Genesis SFII beta...) New poll - New thread - New reply
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Enig
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Posted on 01-23-12 10:07:25 PM (last edited by Enig at 01-23-12 10:09 PM) Link | Quote
Should this go up as something to compare to SFII-SCE? The two are incredibly similar, and the mystery of its' origin and true creator (Capcom or Sega?) is a good study point.
Fuzn
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Posted on 01-23-12 11:02:33 PM Link | Quote
A quick google search led me to a site with some notes on ST II' Turbo: here.
BMF54123

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Posted on 01-24-12 07:48:02 PM Link | Quote
Unless you can prove this "ST II'" is actually a hacked prototype and not just a (fairly advanced) pirate copy of the arcade or SNES version, it doesn't really belong on the wiki (those comparison screenshots to SCE don't count as "proof").
taizou
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Posted on 02-04-12 11:18:24 AM Link | Quote
Well as someone who's quite interested in pirate originals, given that it'd be an incredibly good pirate port if it was one, not to mention one made before unlicensed development for the system had really got into full swing, I thought I'd have a dig around in the rom and see if I could find anything interesting in there.

Around the header there's:
(C)SEGA 1990.JUL
ARM WRESTLING

High score initials @ ~9300: NIN, SIN, HAC, MTI, HRK, CBX (seem to be identical to the arcade version except CBX, which could point to something or other)
(Developer?) Names @ ~B4C0: T.Nagawa, S.Mizutani, Y.Umakosi, A.Watanabe
Test strings @ ~167F0 (with the win quotes): CAPCOM, TEST DATA
Text for the missing endings seems to be in there too.

Google doesn't turn up anything useful on any of the names, so I'm not exactly sure who exactly made it, but it's clear from that at least that it was a Japanese and not a Taiwanese/Chinese production. The Sega copyright possibly suggests they were behind it (obviously it can't have been made in 1990 since that's before the original arcade SF2 came out, but it's probably leftover header from "Arm Wrestling", whatever that was - an unreleased game?) so I can only assume that Sega - or some ghost developer working on their behalf - was originally porting the game, but Capcom, for one reason or another, wasn't happy with the way it was turning out and ended up taking over development.

That might also explain the title - if Sega was initially porting the game without the license (with the intention to obtain it later) they might have left the Street Fighter name off until they had Capcom's approval. That or the leaked proto was bootlegged by a Taiwanese company with the name changed for legal reasons (even though foreign copyrights were more or less unenforceable in Taiwan in the 90s, foreign companies *could* register trademarks, and Capcom actually did - hence early/mid 90s Fami ports of SF2 being called things like Master Fighter, Super Fighter, Street Blaster, Super Blaster, Street Figiter, Fighter Street and so on... even early pirate carts of Street Fighter 2010 called the game "Fighting Street 2010").

The released SF2 has (C)T-12 1993.SEP in place of the SEGA copyright (what's T-12?), the hidden names aren't present and none of them seem to appear in the staff roll, but from a brief play of both, it does seem like the released port was at least based on ST2 (though just about every pixel of graphics was redone in the final) although I can't be sure. I most definitely am sure that ST2 isn't a pirate port, though.
divingkataetheweirdo

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Posted on 02-04-12 12:42:20 PM Link | Quote
Originally posted by taizou
(what's T-12?)


T-12 is Sega's internal third party code for Capcom. This code is usually contained within third party games.

More info here
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Posted on 02-04-12 01:00:01 PM Link | Quote
ahh, that makes sense. thanks! I'm not all that familiar with Mega Drive stuff (except unlicensed games that just put any old crap in there) so I didn't know about that convention.
Fuzn
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Posted on 02-04-12 04:56:51 PM Link | Quote
A sprite comparison:


(Hyper Fighting, SCE Final, ST II Turbo, and CPS1)

Special Champion Edition seems to quite heavily share it's sprite content with the SNES port of Hyper Fighting, albeit the sprites have been adjusted to better match the arcade sprites. ST II Turbo, on the other hand, has an almost entirely different sprite design, at least for Ryu, and seems to be using the nearest equivalent to his palette in the arcade versions.
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Posted on 02-11-12 04:06:19 PM (last edited by ICEknight at 02-11-12 04:07 PM) Link | Quote
I find it quite hard to believe that this was a pirate original, since it shows a bit too much quality to what you'd see in an official prototype. Perhaps both this version and the final were just developed by different teams?

You know that, sometimes (Shinobi III comes to mind), a game that isn't showing a good enough progress in its prototype stages just might get redone from almost scratch (by a different team?), so perhaps this was a similar case?


Also... Why is this particular topic pinned?
Enig
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Posted on 02-11-12 05:05:33 PM Link | Quote
Originally posted by ICEknight
I find it quite hard to believe that this was a pirate original, since it shows a bit too much quality to what you'd see in an official prototype. Perhaps both this version and the final were just developed by different teams?

You know that, sometimes (Shinobi III comes to mind), a game that isn't showing a good enough progress in its prototype stages just might get redone from almost scratch (by a different team?), so perhaps this was a similar case?


Also... Why is this particular topic pinned?


Same here. There's no real way that piraters of the early 90s would go this far to clone Street Fighter II.

Also, I think it got pinned because the game really is a big mystery, and needs some actual research into its' origins, since it's not often that games are found online in a state like this.
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Posted on 03-12-12 11:42:58 AM Link | Quote
>> (those comparison screenshots to SCE don't count as "proof").

But the magazine comparison screenshots do.

In the 1st screenshot, the digit 4 looks like (that is the same 4 from the ROM in question sans the gradient), as opposed to from any other released version of Street Fighter II, arcade or console. (the same could be said about the 7 in the 2nd screenshot)

(the palettes are not imported and were a quick job in yy-chr)

If the ROM in question was actually a well-executed pirate and not a genuine beta version developed by Capcom, it would never be able to have these digits drawn in such a way. The "pirates" would most likely just rip off the graphics from the SNES version (especially since the ROM's graphics are way closer to the SNES version than the final releases's ones are) and get the same "4" as the released version.

Also, here is a video of the letterboxed version used in the magazines -- you can see that it also shares the music and the large font (the one that says "CHAMPION EDITION" near the end) with the ROM in question.

Fuzn
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Posted on 03-12-12 02:28:09 PM Link | Quote
Originally posted by ICEknight
You know that, sometimes (Shinobi III comes to mind), a game that isn't showing a good enough progress in its prototype stages just might get redone from almost scratch (by a different team?), so perhaps this was a similar case?


I second this idea, actually.
SamEarl13

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Posted on 03-13-12 04:04:59 AM Link | Quote
Originally posted by Fuzn
Originally posted by ICEknight
You know that, sometimes (Shinobi III comes to mind), a game that isn't showing a good enough progress in its prototype stages just might get redone from almost scratch (by a different team?), so perhaps this was a similar case?


I second this idea, actually.

They don't just do it for bad prototypes either. Devil May Cry was actually a prototype of resident evil that wasnt like the others in the series and was turned into a different series because of that. I wonder if i can find the prototype. To be on-topic, I can't see SEGA making this, it must be CAPCOM.
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Posted on 03-13-12 06:38:53 AM Link | Quote
Also, done a little research on the ROM.

Surprisingly enough, the occurrence of the word "CAPCOM" mentioned earlier is the only one in the entire game -- even the relative search doesn't give anything else.

-------------

The said victory quotes match the arcade quotes perfectly. No "my dragon punch" instead of "Sheng Long" for Ryu, and no second set of quotes (unlike the SNES version or the released Genesis version).

Also in ASCII are the endings for all the characters (despite the only working endings being the bosses') and all the messages in the game itself (characters winning, "here comes a new challenger" etc.)

Strangely enough, even the messages that have their own sprites (like 'time over') are also encoded here. Also strange is the fact that, despite there being no sprites for lowercase letters, all the boss endings retain their upper/lowercase from the arcade version.

CBX... In fact, he takes the first place in "Special Thanks" for everysingle arcade SF2 release (can't find him in the SNES version, though) and in some other games as well, so finding this name is not something unusual.

-------------

Seriously, though, pirate originals don't get coverage in the official magazines, especially posing as a true thing. The question should not be "Is this a pirate original or the real prototype?", but "Who was originally developing SCE?"
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Posted on 03-14-12 12:41:07 AM Link | Quote
Originally posted by Fuzn
Originally posted by ICEknight
You know that, sometimes (Shinobi III comes to mind), a game that isn't showing a good enough progress in its prototype stages just might get redone from almost scratch (by a different team?), so perhaps this was a similar case?


I second this idea, actually.


Third. How's the coding compare (byte for byte) to the released Genesis version? Are important markers similar? Would that even work?
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Posted on 12-05-14 08:32:31 PM Link | Quote
Here´s a side by side video comparing both on youtube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DBOWhWkQleo
ICEknight
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Posted on 12-06-14 01:29:06 PM Link | Quote
Originally posted by dormonid
Here´s a side by side video comparing both on youtube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DBOWhWkQleo

That's a side-by-side video all right, but both videos are showcasing different things, so... well, they're comparing nothing. =|
divingkataetheweirdo

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Posted on 12-06-14 02:49:52 PM (last edited by divingkataetheweirdo at 12-06-14 02:51:54 PM) Link | Quote
Originally posted by ICEknight

Originally posted by dormonid
Here´s a side by side video comparing both on youtube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DBOWhWkQleo



That's a side-by-side video all right, but both videos are showcasing different things, so... well, they're comparing nothing. =|



Agreed. It should have been edited to show the stages side by side. The only comparison I can see is the title screen, but I think it would have been more effective to show the two versions back-to-back. (For each part of the video, I would have done it to show the prototype first, then the final version.)

I have to scroll between parts of the video for any effective comparison (e.g. For Zangief's stage, I have to jump from 5:07-6:39 for the prototype to 22:28-23:53 for the final version).

A quick note about Zangief's stage: I did note that in the prototype version, they drew the exit sign in such a way that it can be easily misread (It's supposed to read "выход" ("exit"), but in the protoype, it looks like it's "выхоя" (which is gibberish). This was obviously corrected for the final version.
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Posted on 02-27-16 12:15:30 AM Link | Quote
This was a hack released by "The Boss" on 1994-06-02.


********************************************
THE BOSS RELEASED:
STREET FIGHTER II [TURBO] [SEGA/SMD/16]
UPGRADE OF THE NORMAAL STREET FIGHTER II
MADE BY SOME REAL FREAKS!
********************************************
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Posted on 02-27-16 12:29:11 AM Link | Quote
Originally posted by hyper
This was a hack released by "The Boss" on 1994-06-02.


********************************************
THE BOSS RELEASED:
STREET FIGHTER II [TURBO] [SEGA/SMD/16]
UPGRADE OF THE NORMAAL STREET FIGHTER II
MADE BY SOME REAL FREAKS!
********************************************


And do you have a copy of this BS-SF2U.LZH that is this upgrade so we can determine if this is actually the same thing?
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Posted on 02-27-16 11:37:44 AM Link | Quote
As stated before this is the release. After conversion to binary it matches the common dump that is out there. I remember playing this back in 1994 when it was released.

CRC32: A85491AE
MD5: D4A5F1E788DB53F2F1C7FFB6C55DA973
SHA-1: 23E1E1B587A7D2D1A82599D82D01C9931CA7B4CF
SHA-256: FF6FD944D0211F80C12684FFBFBCF4C05EDD5E7460F249A13A17183295474816
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Jul - The Cutting Room Floor - ST II Turbo (weird Genesis SFII beta...) New poll - New thread - New reply




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