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06-22-18 08:51:52 PM
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Jul - Gaming - Celeste ⛰
  
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SC
Posts: 52/62
Finally got around to playing this game and WOW is it an experience. Finished the a-sides earlier today and unlocked almost all of the b-sides. Currently slowly and sluggishly making my way through Chapter 8A, as of posting. Hopefully I won't die too much before I finish it.

But yeah, this game is gonna be one of those games that will forever be a part of my crystal heart. ❤
viviridian
Posts: 6/8
I picked it up on Sunday & spent 7.5 hours across two sittings to get to the peak that day. I may have overdone it a bit cause i have some little unwelcome Gamer Blisters but I was so invested in seeing it through to the end as quickly as possible.

I also didn't understand that you could save & quit, and return to the same spot until I got to the postgame 🤷
Lunaria
Posts: 5490/5576
Mark talked about the game partially in his latest video:

Xkeeper
Posts: 23358/23358
Removing the strawberries and hearts kind of defeats the purpose of this game and its accessibility mode, so I would absolutely leave those in, but add more Summit-like checkpoints to stages where you have some breathing room and a place to try each move in sequence.

The hardest sections of this game are where you need to chain several precise movements together without any opportunity to break and recover, and adding more of those in a theoretical easy mode would make things a lot nicer without having to break the entire game apart.
Lunaria
Posts: 5473/5576
Summit C's last screen is the one I consider just badly designed. I did it without any of the assists, never turned them on. I think the remark by the old lady suggests that it was intentionally designed to be such a big bump in difficulty (because it sure as hell is one)! But that doesn't really change that it's just kind of, EH.

I like assist mode as an accessibility feature, but it kinda leaves something to be desired when it comes to tweaking the difficulty of the game. A proper easy mode would have been nice to have too I'd imagine, it wouldn't even be that hard to tie it into the game, just have it be an easier version of the A side without strawberries and hearts. And once you get to the summit on easy then you should probably be ready for normal if you want to do that I'd imagine.

I'm not too beat up about it though, it's a precision platformer that is rather difficult and it advertises itself as such. ~w~
Xkeeper
Posts: 23358/23358
I ended up smashing through the B and C sides with all of the cheats accessibility features turned on. I was trying to do it "legitimately", but the second to last room of the final chapter pushed me over the edge; it's needlessly frustrating and I decided to say screw it, I'm getting this over with. I just wish the game was a little less frustrating, and that perhaps rather than have totally-cheating mode the game would just have a difficulty option and give you more checkpoints.

I wonder why you can rearrange hearts on the menu. Some people suspect there's a poem there, but ..


The music is nice, too. I'll probably end up buying the OST.
lion
Posts: 21/66
Oh this is by the AUS guy? Explains the calm, mysterious ambience it gives off...
Haven't played it yet, but it looks super fun. Love the aesthetics.
Xkeeper
Posts: 23358/23358
It's a game that lends itself well to short playing sessions, so I'd just get on it if you have the chance. Saving and quitting restores you to exactly where you were in a chapter and the time from starting the game to being able to play it is fairly short.
Shadic
Posts: 6877/6886
Ugh, I've been wanting to play this game ever since I stumbled upon it at PAX West this summer.

Just no time... I'm so glad to see how well it's done, though.
Lunaria
Posts: 5445/5576
I have no problem with some rooms focusing more on being adaptive on the fly, I feel the difficulty curve pretty darn well constructed that such a things isn't a big deal. I don't expect a game like this to be deathless and I don't mind playing the same screens a few times till I beat them. It kinda goes with the territory of being precision platformer to me, what with quick re-spawns and being built for it. If nothing else I straight up don't care about dying a bunch, I guess.

There is actually only a single screen in the entire game which I consider to be straight up terrible when it comes to design. It's in one of the hardest levels in the game though, if any of you have gotten there you probably know which one I mean.

Originally posted by Girlydragon
This was a pet peeve for me while playing the game the first time, exploration and one-ways was not a good mix.

The counter combined with starting midway through a chapter made it a lot better when going back for the strawberries though.
I have to agree, this is one of the bigger flaws of the game if you ask me. I can understand a few points of no returns, like in-between the various major sections of the levels, but there is a lot of arbitrary ones that really didn't need to exist if you ask me. This can get especially bad if you want to 100% a level in a single run, since it's very easy to accidentally just trigger an arbitrary point of no return. I would know since I tried (after beating the game) to do that in chapter 7.

Special shoutouts to:
Spoiler:
The second fucking strawberry in the Mirror Temple segment of chapter 7. You need to get that first, but then actually backtracking for the first strawberry and the gem is absurdly hard (without dying anyway).


I had to restart the entire level twice, both times somewhere in the middle, due to bullshit points of no return because I missed something or did something on accident.



Anyways, I can agree that seeing the core could be considered part of the main game, even if is technicality post game. However I feel asking for four hearts is pretty fair, that's 7 to choose from;
Spoiler:
or alternatively beating a few B-Sides. Some of the hearts don't ask too much of player either, chapter one and six comes to mind. I would have listed the one in chapter two as well, but honestly it was the last one I got because it's stupid, bleh.
(Very mild spoilers)
Xkeeper
Posts: 23358/23358
It would probably be a little easier if the game had "safe points" more where you could at least think for a second. A lot of the game hinges on having to put in rapid direction changes, especially around the final areas. If you don't push anything, you usually just get rocketed into a wall, and if you don't immediately switch from e.g. up left dash to down on some of the later parts you end up in spikes again.

If they just made those wait until you pushed a direction (or at least gave you a second to think) it would be better...
Girlydragon
Posts: 2933/2941
Originally posted by Xkeeper
The problem I have is that a lot of the fun for me is figuring out how to do the room properly, and in longer rooms it just turns into execution. And in some cases, the latter portion of long rooms can basically be trial-and-error, because you can't see it until you get over there.



This is actually on purpose, I read an AMA from the developers, and the designer wanted some of the rooms to be about managing to figure out how you're about to do the thing, and some of them to be about actually managing to do the thing, and most rooms in the main game are either one or the other.

In the B-sides there's a few that are both, and those are quite a pain.


I do find it weird that they have the ability to add the little telescope thing that lets you check the whole map, yet it feels really underused, there's some rooms were I actually did feel like I died mostly because I wasn't aware what was ahead of me.
Xkeeper
Posts: 23358/23358
Originally posted by Sponty
Oddly enough I felt the opposite. The longer segments undoubtedly caused some frustration, but oh man when I got past them the feeling of success was sublime.

The problem I have is that a lot of the fun for me is figuring out how to do the room properly, and in longer rooms it just turns into execution. And in some cases, the latter portion of long rooms can basically be trial-and-error, because you can't see it until you get over there.

And every time you fail, you have to start over from the very beginning. Which means that practicing the final sections can only happen when you get the first section right.

I would probably feel better if there was a little leeway on how you had to do certain moves and tricks, but a lot of the time it came down to "oops, touched a pixel of a spike and died", which just became frustrating.
Girlydragon
Posts: 2932/2941
Originally posted by Xkeeper
I've been passing on strawberries after a few attempts (or just not finding them at all); part of the problem is it's easy to miss things because a lot of transitions are one-way and there's no map to help you find where you're missing things.



This was a pet peeve for me while playing the game the first time, exploration and one-ways was not a good mix.

The counter combined with starting midway through a chapter made it a lot better when going back for the strawberries though.
Sponty
Posts: 11052/11086
The hearts are only half optional, I feel, considering they point you to the core after reaching the summit where you need at least four of them to unlock the "final level". As for the strawberries, I gave up on collecting quite a few of them, especially in the later chapters, just because they can be infuriating to get at.

I'm probably gonna dive back in soon and try and finish up the B-Sides.

Originally posted by Xkeeper
The game is best when the segments are short and only require a few moves in sequence. Longer rooms that require longer chains of actions are annoying and quite frankly the worst parts.


Oddly enough I felt the opposite. The longer segments undoubtedly caused some frustration, but oh man when I got past them the feeling of success was sublime.
Xkeeper
Posts: 23348/23358
There are some rooms in the main game that are way too long for their own good.

I've been passing on strawberries after a few attempts (or just not finding them at all); part of the problem is it's easy to miss things because a lot of transitions are one-way and there's no map to help you find where you're missing things. (The counter at the bottom exists after you beat a chapter, but it doesn't show where you are, so it isn't too useful)

I at least want to get the hearts, though.
Lunaria
Posts: 5444/5576
The hearts and strawberries really are optional though, I don't think the main game (A-side), is really that bad if you skip those things. I only found two hearts on my first lap through the game and I went back to hunt for the rest after I was already finished....
Xkeeper
Posts: 23345/23358
The rest of the game is better. The middle chapters are an awful slog.

The game is best when the segments are short and only require a few moves in sequence. Longer rooms that require longer chains of actions are annoying and quite frankly the worst parts.


I finished the 7th chapter with crystal hearts from chapters 1 through 6. I guess the B-side stages are next, but if it keeps getting harder I might just move to my cheater file and find all the crap through that; I don't have much patience for the extremely difficult stages.
Xkeeper
Posts: 23338/23358
cool game

Chapter 1 was probably the most fun. Chapter 2 was close. Chapter 3 was abysmal. Chapter 4 was only very, very slightly better. Chapter 5 was pretty good, if really long.

I am on chapter 6 now. I like it when the stages are short and fairly easy; the longer complex ones just lead to frustration when you have to execute many perfect moves in sequence, and the input lag does not help.
Lunaria
Posts: 5436/5576
(spoiler image) Eat shit game!
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Jul - Gaming - Celeste ⛰



Rusted Logic

Acmlmboard - commit 5d36857 [2018-03-03]
©2000-2018 Acmlm, Xkeeper, Inuyasha, et al.

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